Can we download this onto the vita? (ANSWER: YES!) - Page 3

gnomeking · 06-26-2012, 01:07 PM

All valid points, and yet I am still lazy. Here I'll do one just to make everybody happy.

Weekly update is up on the PSN and Gungnir still does not work. Not in the Vita store and not via PS3 transfer either. I'll try again next week.

kazriko · 06-26-2012, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnomeking

Weekly update is up on the PSN and Gungnir still does not work. Not in the Vita store and not via PS3 transfer either. I'll try again next week.

Yeah, and they just released another PSP game that isn't Vita compatible as well. Meh. Now I'm waiting on two PSP games to be brought over to Vita.

gnomeking · 06-27-2012, 01:19 AM

Yep, I infer from what we have seen and what Little Atlus has been able to say about this issue that it will be standard operating procedure for PSP games to not be Vita ready at release. Listed future PSP releases however are quite sparse. In fact Growlanser appears to be the only PSP game of note left confirmed to have a US release. I still hope somebody will take an interest in publishing Valkeria Chronicles 3 and that Sega will make a deal to let them since they have no interest bringing the game over themselves. (I am old enough to remember when Sega did not suck)

So for the most part it appears that other then us gamers it is Just Atlus, and now Xseed, who are getting screwed by Sony over all this.

kazriko · 06-27-2012, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnomeking

Yep, I infer from what we have seen and what Little Atlus has been able to say about this issue that it will be standard operating procedure for PSP games to not be Vita ready at release. Listed future PSP releases however are quite sparse. In fact Growlanser appears to be the only PSP game of note left confirmed to have a US release.

Yeah, the rest of the PSP releases that I'm looking forward to are not yet announced, getting cancelled, or getting moved to another platform. I do hope we get FF Type-0 though.

gnomeking · 06-28-2012, 01:54 PM

I agree on wanting FF Type-0 but it it has been out in Japan a long time without even a mention of of a US release so it seems a long shot. Some people think they may do an upgraded version for Vita instead but I don't see how that makes sense given how few Vitas are in the wild versus PSPs.

I suppose the argument for a Vita version instead of PSP would be a belief that even though there are more PSP owners then Vita owners that most PSP owners have moved on and are not paying attention to much less buying new PSP releases. As opposed to Vita owners who are much fewer, but are desperate to buy any game that does not suck so as to have something to play and possibly to help justify having laid out so much dough for the system. I'm not saying this is a valid argument, just that I could imagine publishers believing it.

An enhanced port to the PS3 actually seems like the the most likely place we will see a release of the game outside of Japan. I liked Crisis Core so I'll buy it wherever it shows up, if it ever does.

In other news that no one should care about, while I am still deeply annoyed over the status of Gungnir, at least I have found a game to play while I wait. Zeboyd games Chuthlhu Saves the World finally hit iOS. And at 2 dollars I can actually afford the game. It is a really funny riff on old school jrpgs and a crazy value for its price. Game guy made the new Penny Arcade game. It has been around on PCs and Xbox indie arcade for awhile but this is the first time it has been on a system that is convenient to me (iPad, I don't like gaming on my phone).

In a weird situation, I have an Xbox 360, but it has always been too cheap for me to buy since They use that stupid point system that you have buy in blocks. Of course Sony is only slightly better using real monetary amounts but having that stupid 5 dollar increment thing. No big fan of Apple but at least they only take the amount of money that the software costs out of my account.

kazriko · 06-28-2012, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnomeking

I agree on wanting FF Type-0 but it it has been out in Japan a long time without even a mention of of a US release so it seems a long shot. Some people think they may do an upgraded version for Vita instead but I don't see how that makes sense given how few Vitas are in the wild versus PSPs.

I suppose the argument for a Vita version instead of PSP would be a belief that even though there are more PSP owners then Vita owners that most PSP owners have moved on and are not paying attention to much less buying new PSP releases. As opposed to Vita owners who are much fewer, but are desperate to buy any game that does not suck so as to have something to play and possibly to help justify having laid out so much dough for the system. I'm not saying this is a valid argument, just that I could imagine publishers believing it.

That's what usually drives launch titles, the fact that even though the install base is smaller, they're more motivated than the larger install base of an older console.

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An enhanced port to the PS3 actually seems like the the most likely place we will see a release of the game outside of Japan. I liked Crisis Core so I'll buy it wherever it shows up, if it ever does.

I can't remember SquareEnix releasing any enhanced versions for full sized consoles that originated on portable...

Quote:

In other news that no one should care about, while I am still deeply annoyed over the status of Gungnir, at least I have found a game to play while I wait. Zeboyd games Chuthlhu Saves the World finally hit iOS. And at 2 dollars I can actually afford the game. It is a really funny riff on old school jrpgs and a crazy value for its price. Game guy made the new Penny Arcade game. It has been around on PCs and Xbox indie arcade for awhile but this is the first time it has been on a system that is convenient to me (iPad, I don't like gaming on my phone).

Zeboyd is excellent, and I nag at them every time I see them online to port their games to Vita. Hopefully it will happen when PSM is released.

Still can't wait for Gungnir to come out for Vita. Though, I've diverted myself over to finishing Persona 3 Portable instead. (Such a good game.) Also quite enjoying Trine 2 for the PS3. Best looking game since Muramasa and Odin's Sphere.

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In a weird situation, I have an Xbox 360, but it has always been too cheap for me to buy since They use that stupid point system that you have buy in blocks. Of course Sony is only slightly better using real monetary amounts but having that stupid 5 dollar increment thing. No big fan of Apple but at least they only take the amount of money that the software costs out of my account.

Sony doesn't require $5 increments, just a $5 minimum. If you go to checkout and you're buying a $16 game with $0 in your wallet, it will let you charge exactly $16 to your card.

gnomeking · 06-28-2012, 06:28 PM

While I would love to see Zeboyd on the Vita, you just know they would have to price the games more than double what they cost on PC or iOS if pretty much every mini so far released is any indication. I have trouble having much faith in the PSM initiative given how poorly Sony has been handling, well everything, recently.

I despair at playing Breath of Death since there has been no Mac port and they said no iOS port is planned. If I ever end up with extra points on Xbox I will pick it up but it is not likely.

As for FF-0 on PS3. Your right in that Square has not done a PSP to PS3 port as of yet but it is an option for them and might seem more financially sound then a PSP release. I do not consider it likely, just more likely than a PSP release since the handheld seems to have been abandoned in the west by almost every publisher. I would love to be wrong about this. I almost always prefer RPGs on handhelds as opposed to consoles.

I have still been screwed by the five dollar buy in on PSN. My ex used to buy Rockband songs on occasion and it was a complete nuisance. iOS app store works just fine without a minimum, Sony needs to step up on all fronts if they want to stay in the game. Especially in portable gaming.

kazriko · 06-28-2012, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnomeking

While I would love to see Zeboyd on the Vita, you just know they would have to price the games more than double what they cost on PC or iOS if pretty much every mini so far released is any indication. I have trouble having much faith in the PSM initiative given how poorly Sony has been handling, well everything, recently.

There was a recent article about one of the Minis developers that claimed that their sales on PSP/PS3 dwarfed their iOS sales even though a major publisher helped with their iOS marketing ( http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/1...udios_tale.php ), so hopefully that will carry forward into the Vita PSM sales figures. I don't think Sony's really botched that much recently aside from their slow approval of PSP titles for vita... which is truly terrible.

I don't have an Xbox, and I don't have nor will ever have an iOS device... Plus, I'm willing to pay the premium for a quality port to a quality handheld like the Vita. I have the Zeboyd games on Steam, but will be unlikely to ever finish them because of how little PC gaming time I get. Besides, that time mostly gets dedicated to higher end titles. PC gaming is such a hassle compared to Vita and PS3 gaming. As for PSM though, PSM is a great fit for Zeboyd however because it's all C#, and their games are entirely C#.

Of course, it's not a good fit for Atlus because they are purveyors of fine natively coded games such as the very topical Gungnir, which I'd probably be playing right now instead of discussing this if I could.

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I have still been screwed by the five dollar buy in on PSN. My ex used to buy Rockband songs on occasion and it was a complete nuisance. iOS app store works just fine without a minimum, Sony needs to step up on all fronts if they want to stay in the game. Especially in portable gaming.

iOS counts on massive volume and a huge cut of all of the games to make up for the costs of the credit card charges. Sony's working in a smaller volume market, and we have no idea what their cut or profit on PSN games is. It's not like most games on PSN are less than $5 anyway. It's only when dealing with pathological cases like rockband songs or movie rentals that it's even a minor issue.

And that's all beside the point as Gungnir was a $30 title and wouldn't bring the minimum into it unless you just happened to have between $25.01 and $29.98 in your PSN wallet.

Donnicton · 06-28-2012, 06:57 PM

It's going to three weeks next week that I haven't been able to play this.

This, this is awesome. Bravo, bravo! Looks like I'm gonna have to plan to give Growlanser a good month and Unchained Blades another couple of weeks before I think about buying either one.

Sevyne · 06-28-2012, 09:04 PM

I'm honestly really dieing to get this game, but I refuse to spend the cash on PSP games until they are Vita compatible since I replaced my PSP with a Vita. I know this is currently out of the control of Atlus and it seems to be on Sony's end, but this kind of stuff shouldn't even happen with new PSP releases.

gnomeking · 06-29-2012, 12:08 AM

Kazriko, it is an interesting article but has some odd flaws in its argument. For one they say EA was in charge of marketing but did not mention what if any marketing EA did for the game. They also point out that the game was not suited for a touch interface. Most games arn't. I do not bother with a game on iOS unless it is made by or published by someone I am familiar with and admire (such as Zeboyd), has a good demo, or is recommended by a source I trust. The same standards I hold any game, regardless of platform.

I can certainly see how the fact that there are a minute fraction of games out as minis versus available as apps would be an advantage to the game publisher but I do not see it as an advantage to the gamer. Sure there is more to weed through, but I'll happily do a little more research in exchange to access to a massively larger number of games. Even if good games are needles in a haystack there are a much larger number of needles in a haystack that friggin big.

Wanting the Vita to succeed does not have to equal being against the games on any other platform.

You are probably right that the 5 dollar threshold doesn't come up much as of yet for most people. But it will more and more if the Vita does actually gain some traction. The "full" games cost more then that but the Vita store already has a ton of DlC under 5 bucks and there are hardly any games out. Not to mention the minis, quite a few of which are under 5 bucks.

I just don't see Sony's credit card fees are not my problem. It explains why they may have done it. (I think it is a valid point but also believe that there are other more predatory reasons also at play) But now they have major competition that has eliminated that hassle to handheld digital purchases and they need to find a way to keep up. A little prompt informing you that the only way to buy the 99 cent dlc costume you decided to get for your character on a whim is to transfer five times that amount out of you bank account is not a great way keep your customers happy and using your platform for digital purchases.

On the flip side, it is a good sign to see the digital version of Vita games being regularly priced lower then the hard copy version. About time, and a sign that at least somebody there is paying attention and it might all work out in the end. (if they would only take the hint on the pricing of PS3 digital games). On a side note, I feel like Persona 2 is due for price drop. (of course that might just be because I am broke)

kazriko · 06-29-2012, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnomeking

Wanting the Vita to succeed does not have to equal being against the games on any other platform.

I'm not against other platforms because I want the Vita to succeed.

It's more that I despise Apple and have since the days of the Amiga. I used to have an Xbox, but sold it because I had so few games (Half of them from Atlus.) I don't really want Microsoft to be in control of my gaming to begin with. Atari, Amiga, OS/2, PalmOS, and QNX user here, so Apple and Microsoft have pretty much killed my favorite platforms at every turn since the 1980's. I went to Nintendo and Sony to get away from them, and now they're following me. Nothing really against MS/Apple personally, but the idea of giving money to companies that ruined so many good things just makes me cringe. I'm forced to use MS products professionally but I like to avoid them as much as possible on my recreation time.

Even though I have an Android phone I think it's a terrible gaming platform (Java as a platform for games? Really? I'll have what Google's smoking...)

Quote:

On a side note, I feel like Persona 2 is due for price drop. (of course that might just be because I am broke)

Well, Persona 2 Innocent Sin is their newest PSP Persona game and it hasn't even been out for a year yet. I can't imagine it'll get a price drop any time soon. Maybe in November or early next year.

gnomeking · 06-29-2012, 02:37 PM

I pretty much despise all major tech companies. I've had bad experiences with Microsoft, Apple, Sony, Nintendo, HP, Compaq, and Samsung just to name the ones I can recall off the top of my head. At this point I just go where the games I want are and hope for the best.

I never PC game much since I have been on laptops exclusively since the early Win 95 days. That is actually why I use Macs. The only reliable PC laptop I have ever owned was a Win 95 Toshiba Satellite Pro, that was built like a tank. After it finally died I went through four truly awful PC laptops in under a year. Each put out by a different manufacturer. That was when I said I was done, and went to a Mac laptop. Worked so much better I never went back. I have seen some decently built looking Sony PC laptops over the years, but they were always actually more expensive then the comparable Mac model. (yeah, there were some cheaper Sony models, but they did not appear well made at all) I could not care less about the the OS wars beyond wanting something as hassle free as possible. At least on laptops, for me that was with Apple. The company is straight up sleazy though, no argument there.

I actually have these two friends, one of which used to work for Microsoft in the Xbox division in its earliest days and another that worked for Sony at SCE. They would have long argument trying to trump the other with stories trying to prove their company was being run a more crazy inept manner then the others.

What fascinated me more than anything else was that they both said that the employees in each company did not really see each other as the competition. To them, their biggest threat and focus was other divisions of their own company. Enormous energy was wasted on internal rivalries, since losing resources or top level support to another division was more likely to cause you to lose your job then being outperformed by somebody else's games or hardware.

Kind of like how I should be using this time any focus to play Gungnir, instead of write overly long self indulgent forum posts. Oh right, I can't.

kazriko · 06-29-2012, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnomeking

What fascinated me more than anything else was that they both said that the employees in each company did not really see each other as the competition. To them, their biggest threat and focus was other divisions of their own company. Enormous energy was wasted on internal rivalries, since losing resources or top level support to another division was more likely to cause you to lose your job then being outperformed by somebody else's games or hardware.

That's life in a huge corporation for you. Annoying, eh? Makes you appreciate all of these smaller publishers like Atlus. That's pretty much exactly how large dysfunctional corporations always work. Google is going that way too as they keep trimming services down and cannibalizing them to support their new core priorities.

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Kind of like how I should be using this time any focus to play Gungnir, instead of write overly long self indulgent forum posts. Oh right, I can't.

Nod.

gnomeking · 06-29-2012, 06:02 PM

Google has lost their damn mind.

The tablets make sense, the Hardware companies have failed to put out a Android tablet that has really caught the attention of the mass market so Google might as well try and do it themselves. (Kindle Fire, sorta, but I am not sure most consumers realize it runs Android under Amazon's skin)

But the Nexus Q is profoundly stupid. Who looks at the Apple AirPlay and goes, you know "You know most people seem to think that thing is pointless and overpriced, but I think the key is to make a version with access to an even smaller ecosystem, triple the price, and add an amp." WTF. I actually thought it was a joke at first.

I believe that within five years google will have also expanded into banking, sandwich shops, and gokart racing family fun centers.

Zywack · 07-03-2012, 05:03 AM

Somewhat more on subject since it's an actual game question and that I can't check for myself since I can't play the game yet (I only own a Vita, not a PSP: Playing Yggdra Union in the mean time):

Do you have to use the main character in this game? In the vast majority of games, you are forced to use the main character all the time, but there's some occasional games where it's not the case. Like Star Ocean 4 for example, where you never have to use the main character as soon as you have enough party members and you are never penalized for it since there's no forced battle with him ever.

It's a useful feature in my opinion: If you have a big roster of playable characters you like and that you dislike the main character, why should you be forced to use him?

It's obviously not a must-have, and I have no ideas if the main character for this game is actually likeable or not, but... I saw an early video where you had to pick an "ace" (what does that affect?) and that Giulio wasn't already pre-placed. Does this mean that you don't have to use him if you don't feel like it? And if so, will you be screwed later in the game because you are forced to use him near the end and you will be stuck if he's underlevelled?

No spoilers please

gnomeking · 07-03-2012, 12:59 PM

Sadly, the PSN weekly update is up and Gungnir is still a no show. I have checked both the Vita store and downloaded a new copy to my PS3 and attempted to load to Vita. At least it only takes about three minutes to download the game to my PS3.

Zywack, I have only had chance to play the first couple of maps on a friend's PSP but the Ace system is pretty core to the game mechanics. You can pick who you want as the Ace, and that character gets way more turns then the rest of your team due to a much faster recharge. Like some other Sting games it can get fairly involved but makes sense when you actually get your hands on the game. The Ace is certainly in a position to level a lot more easily then any other team member so it is probably risky to not mostly use the core characters. I have not seen the end game, but as you expressed, there is definately a significant chance to be majorly handicapped if a player ignores the characters that the developer considers central to the story.

kazriko · 07-03-2012, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnomeking

Sadly, the PSN weekly update is up and Gungnir is still a no show.

Aside from the lack of Gungnir, because of this psn update you now have fewer excuses for not getting Persona 2. It's now $15 for this month.

lol, forums · 07-03-2012, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zywack

Do you have to use the main character in this game? In the vast majority of games, you are forced to use the main character all the time, but there's some occasional games where it's not the case. Like Star Ocean 4 for example, where you never have to use the main character as soon as you have enough party members and you are never penalized for it since there's no forced battle with him ever.

Short answer: No.

Long answer: You have to pick an Ace for each battle, and each battle has 1-3 specific characters that you can choose as an Ace. More often than not, Giulio is one of those 1-3. In a few instances, he's the solitary one, so for those battles, yeah, you are forced to use him.

Death of your Ace always results in game over, so that's the main effect of choosing one. Aside from, certain classes will get delay time bonuses based on who you choose as Ace. Unless I'm overlooking something, that's all your Ace really affects.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnomeking

You can pick who you want as the Ace, and that character gets way more turns then the rest of your team due to a much faster recharge. Like some other Sting games it can get fairly involved but makes sense when you actually get your hands on the game. The Ace is certainly in a position to level a lot more easily then any other team member so it is probably risky to not mostly use the core characters.

That's not really true. As I mentioned before your Ace helps certain classes get bonuses to their delay times (e.g. -2 to their delay time), but that doesn't mean the Ace specifically gets a lot more turns. Meanwhile, the shorter delay only even helps so much.

On top of all that, the way turn order works in this game, the player's team get's their turn all at once, and you can choose any character you want to act. However, characters with a will lose some max HP if they're used before their delay time drops a certain amount. Depending on how much time the actions you choose take and how much delay time the next enemy to act has, you can often control multiple characters during your team's turn.

gnomeking · 07-03-2012, 06:50 PM

Kazriku, sweet heads up. I have it downloading now. The timing is perfect since my disability benefits came in today. I missed it since Sony reported the Altus sale separately from the regular weekly update post. that is a killer sale. The only down side is I already have almost every game listed. I knew I had a bunch of Atlus games but I did not realize it was quite so many.

As I said, my time with the game was limited, SINCE IT WON'T PLAY ON VITA, but what I saw was really interesting. As for the Ace system, it actually seemed pretty important to me. You may not be required to pick the Ace more often then others on your turn but it is natural to pick the person who does not automatically lose HP when you chose them. It is like being offered two cookies, but if you pick the cookie on the left, someone will punch you in the face. Not many people are likely to pick the cookie on the left.

I would expect most players to favor the characters in a ready state, of which the Ace will be in more often, except in circumstances where there is an obvious and decided advantage it using another character. Such as a non ready state character being in a position to finish off an enemy when no ready state characters are close enough to be used. The Ace system makes it easier to use a character more often, and thus more easy to level. Of course the game may introduce other elements and systems that have a greater impact on leveling then the Ace system later on since I was limited to seeing only the first couple of battles.

What I saw was super impressive though. Also, the game has some really interesting 'choice' moments right off the bat. In the short time I played I already ran into two points where I had to decide what the character would do next. And in both cases I actually put the game down for a moment to decide because I was torn on which to do. And I really want to go back and try it the other way each time to see what happens instead. That makes for great replay potential (something I rarely want to do) and is top notch story construction. Damn I want to play Gungnir. Well, off to check out Persona 2 at least.

kolaces · 07-03-2012, 07:31 PM

Do aces themselves get wait reductions, or only the classes they give bonuses to? I've been picking aces based on class bonus, not on if the ace would act more. Regardless, I've been playing like Giuilio death = loss. Actually lost a battle because my ace died while I was protecting Giuilio. Must be a habit born from Final Fantasy Tactics.

Glad to hear you're checking out Persona 2 while you wait. I really liked Persona 1 so I want to play Innocent Sin, but haven't had the time to.

gnomeking · 07-03-2012, 07:39 PM

My understanding was that the Aces themselves get a wait reduction, and that certainly seemed to be happening on the couple of maps I played.

four_black_hearts · 07-04-2012, 08:22 AM

Aces do not receive a reduction to their own Wait Time just for being chosen, they only provide the bonus to the classes listed when you select them as the Ace!

gnomeking · 07-04-2012, 09:24 PM

Oooooh, that's good to know.

gnomeking · 07-10-2012, 10:47 AM

Weekly PSN update is up and Gungnir still does not work. Will report again next week assuming nothing changes before then.

Donnicton · 07-10-2012, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnomeking

Weekly PSN update is up and Gungnir still does not work.

Zywack · 07-11-2012, 04:06 AM

Well, it's not the news I wanted, but... Thanks for the news anyway!

And so the waiting continues... Well, I still have a whole lot of Yggdra Union's to go so it's not that bad for me as long as it does get released eventually. I'm not sure I'll be that patient with Growlanser if it has the same Vita incompatibility, though!

nighthawk282 · 07-13-2012, 12:31 PM

I'm not sure how often you guys are checking this thread, so you may find this out before you read my post but I felt I should inform you, (and I made an account just to do so), that THE GAME FINALLY FREAKIN' WORKS ON THE PS VITA! Just transferred it over myself. It's been sitting on my PS3 since it launched, and I didn't need to redownload it or anything!

Thanks for keeping this thread running, but now you all owe me!

kazriko · 07-13-2012, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nighthawk282

I'm not sure how often you guys are checking this thread, so you may find this out before you read my post but I felt I should inform you, (and I made an account just to do so), that THE GAME FINALLY FREAKIN' WORKS ON THE PS VITA! Just transferred it over myself. It's been sitting on my PS3 since it launched, and I didn't need to redownload it or anything!

Thanks for keeping this thread running, but now you all owe me!

Thanks for the heads up here. I can confirm that it's also copying over to the Vita here. Not only that, but another game I bought ages ago but couldn't play, Susume Tactics, is also copying over now to the Vita, so I have tons of new stuff to play. I'll probably finish Persona 3 first though...

gnomeking · 07-14-2012, 01:37 AM

Yep, just copied it over and made sure it booted alright. The game is only available via PS3 transfer at this point. I just checked the Vita store and it ain't there. I had hoped we were close since Sony had confirmed a couple of old PSP games being added to Vita for next week's Tuesday release. I figured there might be more coming and they only bothered to mention the ones they considered highest profile (one they mentioned was a GTA game).

Hopefully the store will update soon as well but at least anybody who already bought the game via their PS3 (like me) can play now. Fingers crossed that Growlancer get running on the Vita faster. Though between Gungnir and Spectral Souls on my iPad I'll be busy for awhile.